Sunday, November 9, 2008

Commentary by a Russian Submarine Writer on the Nerpa Tragedy


(Caption: Project 971 K-152 Nerpa at Bol'shoy Kamen', life.ru)


Russian author and long-time submariner Alexandr Pokrovskiy on the accident on board the multipurpose submarine Nerpa.

"While departing her base at the closed military city (ZATO) Bol'shoy Kamen' for sea trials on the 8th of November at 2030 local time on board the multipurpose submarine Nerpa (Project 971 Shchuka-B, NATO Akula II), there was an uninteded discharge of the firefighting system and Freon. Six service members and fourteen civilians were killed. Another twenty two were hospitalized. There were 208 on board, eighty one of them military", which is all the mass media has told us so far.

One of the peculiarities of the Project 971 Shchuka-B is its reliance, in comparison with other submarine classes, on automatic combat and technical systems. Control is effected from one center - the main command post. The crew usually numbers seventy three. Since there were 208 on boards, that means that there was a big sea trials crew on board and it also means that it was crowded and there was no where for people to sleep. Unfortunately, this is the way sea trials are done since the ships systems and mechanisms must be tested for reliability. This is common during sea trials.

The mass media has talked about "a fire outbreak" which led to an "unplanned release of extinguishing agent (Freon)".

If a fire breaks out completely unexpectedly, then "an unplanned release of extinguishing agent" couldn't happen - let us remember that all control of technical systems takes place from one center on this class of boat. Freon just can't "get released" into the space. It needs to be released there. By the way, a little bit about freon. Freon is only used in big fires in submarine spaces. Before it is used, all people in the compartment have to be connected to the emergency air lines. That or death by suffocation. Besides that, after a release of freon, all the electrical panels and electronic systems go out of service. That is to say, the compartment ceases to function after a freon discharge. Therefore submariners don't like to use freon.

In domestic shipbuilding, the use of freon extinguishing systems has its partisans and opponents. For many years there has been a fight to put modern methods of fire supression on board submarines. There has been talk of special nitrogen systems. Nitrogen floods the compartment lowering the concentration of oxygen to 12 percent and the fire extinguishes. In this case even people who couldn't hook up to low pressure air would remain alive and the equipment in the space doesn't suffer.

People have asked me: why does the automatic fire suppression system on board use freon?

I answer: because in Russia, its always been like that. They construct a super-modern boat, but they put previous century equipment on board. And so it goes...

51 comments:

Bubblehead said...

I'm really surprised about all this talk about Freon. Is there possibly a translation problem, and they're really talking about Halon? Is the Russian word the same for this class of halocarbons, whether they're used in refrigeration (Freon) or fire suppression (Halon)?

Russian Navy Blog said...

I wish it were a translation problem. There are two separate words - Khladon (Halon) and Freon, which is freon in Russian and English. A source I cited in the previous entry flatly stated that the "extinguishing agent is хладон 114В2" (Halon 114B2), which is awfully specific to my mind.

Who knows? Maybe the Russians really do use freon for damage control (doubtful). I think what is happening is that freon is being used in the press because everyone is familiar with freon (I think Freon is a trademark of Dupont) and who can bother to distinguish between two haloalkane refrigerants anyway?

Anonymous said...

"And so it goes... "

Also penned by Kurt Vonnegut in Slaughterhouse Five, one of the more depressing books ever written.

I didn't know Nitrogen leaves humans alive but puts out fires. I wonder if the USN uses nitrogen?

nfgusedautoparts said...

The old Halon style agents depended on completely displacing oxygen, you had to get out of the room. The newer agents (Inergen is a common brand name in the US) are blends of inert gasses (Nitrogen & argon, for example) that just lower the oxygen content below the point where combustion is supported. they are generally safer than Halon for humans plus they are a bit "greener" (and since Halon is getting real expensive, they're cheaper.)

Risk_Security said...

Dorogoy Alexandr Pokrovskiy,
Since you know the Russian Navy "concepts" it may be that you can help me to answer a question on a more deep technical level. I do work in fire protection in Brazil, where I live, and in our discussions group a question was stated on which type of Freon (chemical composition) is comonly used as fire extinguishing midia for russian submaries. Could you help me on that? My e-mail is a.gromow@hotmail.com just in case you you prefer to use this communication channel.
Bolshoi spacybo
Alexander Alexandrovitch Gromow

Hobodog said...

Freon is just the Dupont name for its line of Halon style chemicals. (Haloalkanes). In the Case of Halon 114B2 it is probably referring to C2F4Br2, known primarily as the B2 variant of a common refrigerant, R114. The B2 meaning that the 2 chlorines in R114 are replaced with 2 bromine atoms. It's IUPAC name would be Dibromotetrafluoroethane if you care to look it up further.

Risk_Security said...

Thank you very much Matthew for having taken your valuable time to help me!
Good and proper technical information that will allow me to disclaim the CFC media I usually use in my work – good job.
Nevertheless I'm sorry for the losses of lives - this was for sure not the idea, hopefully improvements will come after this tragedy. But fire (was not the case, I know – it occurred during a wrong operation during a simulation) in a submarine is an utmost critical situation, indeed. This is only for skulled trained heroes that serve in these vessels...
Best regards
Alexander

Anonymous said...

The value of Halons in fire extinguishment is that they do NOT displace oxygen, resulting in less material being required to put out a fire, and usually more rapid fire extinguishment. Instead, Halons interrupt the fire reaction. There are three well-known Halons, 1301, 1211, and 2402. They are considerably different in their properties. Only Halon 1301 can be used for room-flooding in concentrations which will both extinguish fires and which are safe for at least some period of exposure. Carbon dioxide displaces oxygen to extinguish fire, and therefore would not be safe to humans in room-flooding situations. Halon 1301 was commonly used throughout the world due to its safety for room-filling applications. Halon 1301 is no longer produced in the West due to ozone-depletion concerns. For accurate information on Halons and other gas agent fire extinguishing, I recommend reference to [USA] National Fire Protection Association (NFPA) Standard 12A (for Halon 1301) and Standard 2001 (for new Halon replacements). I don't have a google account, so this will appear as anonymous. Call me "Halon guy".

Anonymous said...

I should add that Freons and Halons can be the same exact material. For example, Freon 13B1 is the same material as Halon 1301. Freon 114B2 is exactly the same material as Halon 2402. These are just two different naming/numbering systems.
from "Halon guy"

Anonymous said...

For Halon 114B2 what is the concentration of the chemical used for fire fighting (gm/m3)and what is the lethal concentration for humans. Is there any data available? Was the concentration high ehough to cause instant death and not even give the personnel a chance to escape?

Anonymous said...

nice article

Anonymous said...

You have a year typo of 2030 on this post.

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